[Mugwui]

So I sent my 99 LWB GV with steel diff in thismorning to have front and rear lockers fitted with 2 doner Crown wheels & Pinions of 5.12 ratio.
Now when I dropped if off they nicely informed me that it was going to cost me an extra $190 per diff to swap them over, ok fair enough, if thats the price then do it.

Now....After all the research I have done and all the advice I have been given from the members of Auszookers....ARB just rang me and told me that thet dont fit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WHAT THE FUCK IS GOING ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!???????????????????

What was going to be a front locker for $1800, I then decided to bo both and has now cost me close to $4000 and I still dont have 5.12 gears, or locker installed.

So who is right and who is wrong?
Is Every Member of AZ wrong and ARB are right
or is ARB WRONG?????????????????

[royce]

What part of it doesnt fit?

[Mugwui]

They are saying that the pinion and crown wheel of the 5.12, dont fit into the genuine steel carrier of the GV.
I know people have done this before and I have been told it is a straight swap, Now ARB are talking about cutting, grinding and shimming? They shouldnt have to.

[mike.knew]

Are you sure they are talking about the pinion and crown wheel and not the carrier and the sump? Meaning the carrier doesn't fit in the car itself? I just had mine done (no 5.12's though) ... steel diff and carrier (from a late model GV) into the front of a vitara and the carrier hit the sump.

A bit of work in the press and it all fitted - I updated this thread to inform it is not a bolt on job like it looks at first:
http://www.auszookers.com/index.php?nam ... pic&t=6930

[royce]

I have held in my hands 2 steel GV centers with 5.12 gears and airlockers in them, 1 went in an 88 shorty with no sump mods needed (was hard to get in though)

fitting the pinion into teh steel center and shimming it up to the correct height and preload isnt a job for a towbar fitter, needs to go to a proper diff shop to setup.

[atari4x4]

The sump/diff clearance wouldn't change unlike what happened to you Mike as it's a GV diff in a GV.

Would it not be the same drama that Stuey & Me have with the drivers side CV not locating properly on the circlip in the locker end?

I've put the 5.12's in & the diff dude that built it all up didn't mention any grinding/cutting/shimming.

Joe should be able to shed some more light on the situation

[Mugwui]

So ARB should be capable of getting it right then? They have told me since I first posted that the pinion is to long and it needs to be shimmed, now I can fit the tow bar, so thats why the car is at ARB as I thought they'd be able to handle it.
If I were to go back through all my threads, I could quite safely put my left nut on that no one has ever posted the correct information.
Its all been, ....Just do it !!!! it'll fit, its been done before.... PIGS ARSE.
It Doesn't just fit....If your going to post information ZOOKERS, make sure its correct!!!!! we're not all mechanics and engineers.

[mike.knew]

atari4x4 wrote:

Would it not be the same drama that Stuey & Me have with the drivers side CV not locating properly on the circlip in the locker end?

ARB ended up modifing the CV to make it fit into the side gears (the spline actually). I highlighted the potential issue a couple of times, gave them print out from information I had gathered and it wasn't until only a small amount of force and "pop" the CV was out that they looked into it further and now the CV doesn't pop out so easily after the modification. I went for a wheel over the weekend and no issues with the CV.

[royce]

Mugwui wrote:

So ARB should be capable of getting it right then? They have told me since I first posted that the pinion is to long and it needs to be shimmed, now I can fit the tow bar, so thats why the car is at ARB as I thought they'd be able to handle it.
If I were to go back through all my threads, I could quite safely put my left nut on that no one has ever posted the correct information.
Its all been, ....Just do it !!!! it'll fit, its been done before.... PIGS ARSE.
It Doesn't just fit....If your going to post information ZOOKERS, make sure its correct!!!!! we're not all mechanics and engineers.

Listen here idiot, calm down or you gone, understand me?

it fits, many people have done it, I can go get a complete steel diff with airlocker and 5.12 diffs and throw it at you right now if you wish

go google how the fuck to set a diff up and whats needed to achieve this, the pinion height has to be shimmed to get teh correct height to mesh with the crownwheel properly, this is a job for a specialist diff shop, not a mob that fit towbars, otherwise such shops wouldnt exist, if you sjtu grab bits and plonk it is it doesnt work and thats true of EVERY diff in the world, from zooks to massive 40 spline 9"'s

[Mugwui]

mike.knew wrote:

atari4x4 wrote:

Would it not be the same drama that Stuey & Me have with the drivers side CV not locating properly on the circlip in the locker end?

ARB ended up modifing the CV to make it fit into the side gears (the spline actually). I highlighted the potential issue a couple of times, gave them print out from information I had gathered and it wasn't until only a small amount of force and "pop" the CV was out that they looked into it further and now the CV doesn't pop out so easily after the modification. I went for a wheel over the weekend and no issues with the CV.

What Car have you had it fitted into Mike.Knew and Atari4x4?

[mike.knew]

Mugwui wrote:

mike.knew wrote:

atari4x4 wrote:

Would it not be the same drama that Stuey & Me have with the drivers side CV not locating properly on the circlip in the locker end?

ARB ended up modifing the CV to make it fit into the side gears (the spline actually). I highlighted the potential issue a couple of times, gave them print out from information I had gathered and it wasn't until only a small amount of force and "pop" the CV was out that they looked into it further and now the CV doesn't pop out so easily after the modification. I went for a wheel over the weekend and no issues with the CV.

What Car have you had it fitted into Mike.Knew and Atari4x4?

Both are 2.0L Vitara (not GV). I had a different carrier though but as Atari has pointed out you have a GV so that/this is not your issue. I actually haven't changed diff centers so if you are talking about the ring and pinion then I am not going to be able to help - I was just sharing what little O know - I just work on computers but like to help where I can.

I think royce is saying is that you need someone who knows how to work on diffs "and not just a tow bar fitter" - the issue you are having is something that needs to be done on all diff centers when you pull them apart and put the back together.

I hope I haven't added confusion

[atari4x4]

Mugwui wrote:

mike.knew wrote:

atari4x4 wrote:

Would it not be the same drama that Stuey & Me have with the drivers side CV not locating properly on the circlip in the locker end?

ARB ended up modifing the CV to make it fit into the side gears (the spline actually). I highlighted the potential issue a couple of times, gave them print out from information I had gathered and it wasn't until only a small amount of force and "pop" the CV was out that they looked into it further and now the CV doesn't pop out so easily after the modification. I went for a wheel over the weekend and no issues with the CV.

What Car have you had it fitted into Mike.Knew and Atari4x4?

Mugwhi,

I have an RD 88 fitted into an early GV steel carrier & housing! They went into a SV420 vitara, but what vehicle that they are fitted is not the issue by the sound of it.

I still have the issue of the drivers side CV not locating properly in the RHS of the diff as described by Mike above.

The actual gears fitted without any grinding/shimming or anything else... unless the diff dude did it with out charging me or telling me about doing it!

Take a chill pill we're trying to help & by the sounds of it, it is beyond the skill level of the accessory fitter at ARB!

[SuziBlu]

atari4x4 wrote:

Mugwui wrote:

mike.knew wrote:

atari4x4 wrote:

Would it not be the same drama that Stuey & Me have with the drivers side CV not locating properly on the circlip in the locker end?

ARB ended up modifing the CV to make it fit into the side gears (the spline actually). I highlighted the potential issue a couple of times, gave them print out from information I had gathered and it wasn't until only a small amount of force and "pop" the CV was out that they looked into it further and now the CV doesn't pop out so easily after the modification. I went for a wheel over the weekend and no issues with the CV.

What Car have you had it fitted into Mike.Knew and Atari4x4?

Mugwhi,

I have an RD 88 fitted into an early GV steel carrier & housing! They went into a SV420 vitara, but what vehicle that they are fitted is not the issue by the sound of it.

I still have the issue of the drivers side CV not locating properly in the RHS of the diff as described by Mike above.

The actual gears fitted without any grinding/shimming or anything else... unless the diff dude did it with out charging me or telling me about doing it!

Take a chill pill we're trying to help & by the sounds of it, it is beyond the skill level of the accessory fitter at ARB!

lol yep, far beyond the apprentices they employ, or the main man who has fuk all knowledge about much at all.

You should have come here first and asked who to use.

[lump_a_charcoal]

Mugwui wrote:

So ARB should be capable of getting it right then? They have told me since I first posted that the pinion is to long and it needs to be shimmed, now I can fit the tow bar, so thats why the car is at ARB as I thought they'd be able to handle it.
If I were to go back through all my threads, I could quite safely put my left nut on that no one has ever posted the correct information.
Its all been, ....Just do it !!!! it'll fit, its been done before.... PIGS ARSE.
It Doesn't just fit....If your going to post information ZOOKERS, make sure its correct!!!!! we're not all mechanics and engineers.

Mate next time you need help you can go and suck my dick. You are a big boy, do some fucking research instead of acting all butthurt and blaming others for your lack of understanding.

[Mugwui]

I'm not trying to upset anyone here, I'm just trying to get to the bottom of what I'm actually ment to do...
As SuziBlu said...."maybe I should have asked who to use"....so maybe I've just been asking the wrong questions!!!! but with the amount of response I have had on past threads I thought it was all clear, hence, jumping in and paying to have the job done.

And Royce, no need to be so graphic!!! Email, txt and print doesn't show the true emotion and whom it's directed at!
I've hade some great advice & physiacl help from some great people eg: Steknig, Joblow, Bruce just to mention a few...My Beef is with ARB and the odd one that thinks they know what they are talking about.
If you new me, you'd know I dont get stressed about shit. No Harm!!!!

[Bruce]

I can tell you a really good diff shop in North Brisbane.
I can also tell you that I have held 5.12 diffs with air lockers. Same diffs that Royce would be talking about I'm sure.
My GV had front and rear lockers. They were 4.875 but trust me 5.12 ratios will fit.
PM me what ARB store you are at. I know most of them well.

[Stuey]

I can understand your frustration mate. But "coming across" as though you are yelling and screaming at everyone wont help. You can already tell Royce is fired up with a finger hovering above the BAN button. So, take a step back and try to approach this with a clear mind....and try to solve the problem systematically.

Mugwui wrote:

They are saying that the pinion and crown wheel of the 5.12, dont fit into the genuine steel carrier of the GV.
I know people have done this before and I have been told it is a straight swap, Now ARB are talking about cutting, grinding and shimming? They shouldnt have to.

Correct, they shouldnt have to (besides the shimming as this is part of setting up a diff). I have 5.125 ring and pinion gears taken from a donor early model 1.6 ltr Vitara, and they have been installed into the steel third member of Grand Vitara in conjunction with an RD88 front air locker. This assembly was then installed into a Grand Vitara steel diff housing. No cutting, grinding etc needed.

Quote:

Now when I dropped if off they nicely informed me that it was going to cost me an extra $190 per diff to swap them over, ok fair enough, if thats the price then do it.

I imagine this cost has come about from the need to remove your old pinion gear, pressing on a new bearing and reinstalling. That is unavoidable in doing a 5.125 swap, and would not normally be needed when istalling a locker while retaining factory gearing. Your ring gear is normally removed then installed onto the ARB centre as part of the locker install. In this case, your original ring gear is removed, and enchanged for the 5.125 ring gear and installed onto the locker. This part of the install should bear no cost as the ring gear was always going to be removed and reinstalled.

Quote:

They have told me since I first posted that the pinion is to long and it needs to be shimmed

Sounds like people need to get their stories straight. Earlier I could have sworn I read that the ring gear didn’t fit either?! Shimming the pinion is a normal part of setting up a diff. Their point is???? If anything, I’m thinking that the installer at the ARB place isn’t up to the task of doing the gear swap. To my knowledge, the pinions from all 1.6 models are the same length as those from a Grand Vitara? (anyone confirm?) And the diameter of the ring gear is also the same. So why wouldn’t it fit?!

It is also irrelevant that the Ataris, Mikes and my locker have gone into an SV420 Vitara, not a GV. Because they have still gone into an equivalent housing.

Maybe to try to help you understand the locker install process, watch this vid:
ARB Locker Install

The more info you can provide us with as to their supposed problems, the better prepared we can be to help you sort it.

[Mugwui]

Thanks Stuey, Yes you are right in all your points.
I have just had some advice that I am going to follow by a fellow zooker
which I probably should have spoken to this person weeks ago.

Thanks again, sorry if I've pissed anyone off, it was not my intention.

[joeblow]

F@#K i wish people would just send diffs to me to do!............


what store?. if we can arrange shipment to me i will fit the front at no cost to you.

[Mugwui]

Joe, Had I have know that, I would have done it in the first place.
ARB Nundah, Brisbane.
See how you go, I'm in no hurry for the car, its not my daily driver.
I was told about an hour ago I should have PM'd you first... Oh well Live and learn, live... and ... learn.

[joeblow]

just make sure they are not trying to fit a rear 5.1 gearset to the front. that will not not work.


get them to contact me at head office care of Joe Leban. you pay the frieght, i will fit the locker as a 'one off' at no charge. just make sure its a front gearset that we have, and not a rear!






P.S...ODA1...... Bob in the swb grand is loving his ratios and rear air locker!

[Mugwui]

So I have given them both front and rear 5.1's out of a 96 Vitara as they are doing both front and rear lockers.
When I handed over the Crown wheels and pinions, they were both labled F & R, so maybe they mix them up and that is why they are having problems?
I will call them in the morning ans try to sort it out.
Thanks for you help Joe.

[steak_knife]

Mugwui wrote:

So I have given them both front and rear 5.1's out of a 96 Vitara as they are doing both front and rear lockers.
When I handed over the Crown wheels and pinions, they were both labled F & R, so maybe they mix them up and that is why they are having problems?
I will call them in the morning ans try to sort it out.
Thanks for you help Joe.

I was thinking that on the way home, thay may of mixed em up.

Or heaven forbid, you did after I gave you the R&P's

[atari4x4]

Mugwui wrote:

and the odd one that thinks they know what they are talking about.

I'm really hoping this wasn't directed at anyone off this forum!

Please explain?

[shep]

atari4x4 wrote:

Mugwui wrote:

and the odd one that thinks they know what they are talking about.

I'm really hoping this wasn't directed at anyone off this forum!

Please explain?

dont worry about it mate, i think lumpy has the right idea.

[joeblow]

just trying to eliminate the 'simple shit' first.



case in point.

recently had a friend of a friend want a ratio change in a sierra. he bought the diffs himself from a wrecker in melb (more than i could have sourced them for) and asked for two vit fronts for a sierra.

gets to my joint..........well....sent him off again on a sat arvo to exchange the REAR for a front. and the cheeky wrecker asked for the front housing back!

like i said...........eliminating simple stuff first......

[steak_knife]

joeblow wrote:

just trying to eliminate the 'simple shit' first.



case in point.

recently had a friend of a friend want a ratio change in a sierra. he bought the diffs himself from a wrecker in melb (more than i could have sourced them for) and asked for two vit fronts for a sierra.

gets to my joint..........well....sent him off again on a sat arvo to exchange the REAR for a front. and the cheeky wrecker asked for the front housing back!

like i said...........eliminating simple stuff first......

I stripped these diff's joe, has one front & one rear.

I have a feeling thay may have been mixed up along the way.

[Mugwui]

I bought a whole 96 vit and wrecked it so I have the front and rear out of it. Steknig pulled then out for me as I had never don it before. Steknig then took them to his auto workshop and broke them down and handed me (wraped seperately) a front and a rear, I opend them for a photo and put them back as I found them as I know the importance of not mixing them up. I also labled them L & R and put them in the back of the GV.
Got to ARB, showed them, told them what I wanted and drove away. the rest has been crespondance via Phone.
What else would you like to know? eliminating the simple stuff I can do!

PS. This was the pic
They were kept seperate the whole time.

[shep]

new crush spacers?

[ball]

I hope you are putting new bearings on them.