[Andygoodbloke]

Please be aware the screws are not Philips or Posi drive they tend to be JIS - that is Japanese Industrial standard which was common on Suzuki cars and bikes in the 80's to 90's

They are straight cross shape without any centre cross lines or square which means if a Philips or Posi is used it is more likely to strip it out.

They are a bugger to undo on the screws up under the wheel flares and when hit with an impact driver the turn them into a harder remove screw with them now being countersunk so you cannot get a chisel on them or an angel grinder to make the square, plus the button heads don't leave enough thickness of material to get a good grip on with a spanner, particularly if beaten in.

The chisel spot and impact driver may work on some but not all, leaving lots of swearing and screws still done up, so tack welding another bolt/nut on may work as long as you get the settings correct and low enough to weld a bolt/nut onto the stuck screw without melting everything or removing all paint in the surrounding area including the other side.

Hope this helps

[Gwagensteve]

You’ve already posted this in good tech though? What do you want somebody to do?

JIS screwdrivers are nice, for sure, but the while issue with these screws generally can’t be undone with a screwdriver regardless of how well the bit fits. This is especially true of the flare retaining screws. It’s better to just drill them out and save the drama.

I’m not aware of JIS impact bits, they may exist, but in my experience the door screws require more force to undo than the screw can tolerate. Using an impact driver, (air or hammer) will distort the body before the screw undoes. The beauty of using a cold chisel is it only applies force to the screw to undo it. It doesn’t push the body in to try and retain bit that then has torque applied to it. Also, applying force to the outside edge of the screw makes for a much longer lever than a screwdriver bit.

[laager]

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[Gwagensteve]

I’m not though. Andy doesn’t mention JIS impact bits, only screwdrivers.

Rhino tools seem to offer impact bits “manufactured to JIS” but they also claim they fit Philliips so :shrug: not sure what to make of that.

[Andygoodbloke]

You can get Impact drivers and bits in JIS
go to https://www.aliexpress.com/
search under "JIS Impact driver"
They are a good supply of suzuki parts also, anything from hub lock 26 spline to new Carbs, to door handles all sorts

[laager]

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[Andygoodbloke]

As a conclusion
The JIS screws around the guard flares were drilled out with a 5.5mm drill.
Once on the bench a good clean, and a sand, rust proof and re paint and the drilled out nuts and welded bases were cut flush with an angle grinder and cutting disk and replaced with M6 Riv-nuts
They were then bolted back on with M6 stainless bolts with a washer so it ever needed to be taken off it won't be a hard job

Not brave enough to try the door JIS screw yet, but it is coming up

[Gwagensteve]

100% guaranteed they won’t come undone next time you try. Stainless bolts in plated nutserts will gall and the nutsert will spin.

Been through this countless times. The flare bracket is too thin for a nutsert to work properly and once the stainless thread is dirty it won’t undo.

[Andygoodbloke]

I am aware of this which is why the rib nuts are Aluminium

[Andygoodbloke]

Gnarling happens with 2 grades of stainless which are the same grade so to prevent this the nuts are usually a different grade to the bolt, but have not heard of it happening between mild steel and stainless, but yes it could happen, more likely to turn into a battery with electrolysis but that usually happens with copper, will wait and see and paint everything so the paint becomes the issue in removing
Either way it is an improvement on what was there

[Andygoodbloke]

I have painted the drivers door and put on the replacement M8 bolts

I wanted a dark colour black bolt as I think it looks good against the red of the body.

Get get the door bolts off I used a strong arm bar with the impact socket and JIS head in it. I pushed in and twisted and got one out, leaving 7 more. I tried the impact socket and screw driver and an FBH (f***** big hammer,) it put too much pressure on and flared the sides of the cross out.

I then proceeded to get the angle grinder out and cut a flat grove onto the bolt without cutting too deep and marking the material behind it, then a dot punch and FBH and gently tapped it around until it was able to be grabbed by a strong pair of pliers and twisted off. I had to cut another flat section after turning and tapping the first upside down and not being able to move it further

When putting the replacement bolts back in, a spot of grease was added to the thread to make next time easier, plus having a hex head for a socket, plus the rust developing around the hinge was dealt to and treated, as prevention is the better option and behind the hinge where it sat on the body needed curing too.

Glad it will only need to be done once as hammers and fingers mix - too well

Thanks Andy

[Gwagensteve]

Andygoodbloke wrote:

Get get the door bolts off I used a strong arm bar with the impact socket and JIS head in it. I pushed in and twisted and got one out, leaving 7 more. I tried the impact socket and screw driver and an FBH (f***** big hammer,) it put too much pressure on and flared the sides of the cross out.

Did you believe the JIS bits would make so much difference that you would succeed where many years of experience on this board suggested it's not possible to remove them with a driver? I"m not denying JIS are nice to have, especially for precision work on carbs etc, but they're not a magic bullet to undo screws that are frozen in place.

A friend who has been into sierras far longer than me swore by using an air hammer with a trick Snap-On impact screwdriver bit with a cross bar on it, so you could hammer the screw and then get a LOT of leverage on the driver whilst hammering.

Where the screws were properly stubborn the air hammer just punched the panels in without the screw budging making a bigger mess.

Want 33's guide is in good tech because it works and it's very, very quick.

[Andygoodbloke]

I tried and got 1 out of 8 on one side.
I believe using the correct tool for the job helps and was worth a go before other methods were used
No swearing (apart from finger hits) or excessive use of force resulting in worse damage
I have not done the other door yet as that has not been painted.
Sorry the photo attachment turned the picture 90 degrees so it has the wide side across