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Front brake upgrade - what I did.
https://www.auszookers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=16131		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  paulv [ Thu Oct 21, 2010 1:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Front brake upgrade - what I did.
Used these things to do the job.
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New bits in the middle. Old bits on the outside
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Specifically - the calipers are from a 4 door long wheel base Vitara.
The rotors are DBA514, also 4 door long wheel base Vitara.
In this case the sloted variety from Disk Brakes Australia- one DBA514SL and one DBA514SR


Got the local brake specialist to make up some new longer hoses.
New ones are the shiny ones. Passenger side is the top hose.
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DB1266 pads
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Jacked the thing up.
Put the stands under.
Ripped the wheels off.
Chucked the wheels under the car.
Cracked the 2 big caliper mouting bolts on each side.
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Cracked the hose connections while the calipers where still bolted up.
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Undone the other end of the hose on each side.
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Clips off.
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Everything off....
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Wiped the surface of the new rotors with some metho and chucked em on.
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Caliper, Caliper mounting bolts next - no pads.
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Hoses.
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Flip the caliper back and drop the pads in....
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Close the caliper on the pads.
Put the final caliper slider bolts in
Bleed em up, replentish the fluid.
Put the wheels back on.
Stands and Jack out.
all done....

Works ok for me.
Author:  mnemonix [ Thu Oct 21, 2010 4:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
Awesome DIY mate. I'm sure this will be useful for plenty of ppl.
Author:  paulv [ Thu Oct 21, 2010 8:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
Thank you gentlemen. Point is, it was extreemly easy. For the coily, no cuting or bending, no troubles bleeding. Hardest part was locating the donor calipers. Needed to be from specifically the 4 door variety Vit, built between 91-98
Author:  kirstyandgrace [ Thu Oct 21, 2010 9:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
tanshi wrote:
this should probably go in good tech :D


Agreed.

Good write up, even the more spanner challenged amongst us can follow these instructions. 8)
Author:  jonno_racing [ Thu Oct 21, 2010 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
i like it.

how much better is the end result? and what did it cost in total? if you dont mind me asking....

see things do fit coilys :D
Author:  ck13488 [ Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
nice write up mate...its stuff like this that makes the forum so dam useful!

can there be a downside to have the slotted rotors with sand and shit getting in between the pad and caliper easier?
Author:  paulv [ Fri Oct 22, 2010 12:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
Author:  tanshi [ Fri Oct 22, 2010 12:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
mine cost me all up about $100, but they had been recently rebuilt and the disks were good.

I also put in a bigger master cyl. but the improvemnt for me was huge.
Author:  Built4thrashing [ Fri Oct 22, 2010 5:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
Those brakes combined with a Disc rear set up and a Forester master cly would be an awsome combination........I do have a subi master cly for sale you know.



B4T
Author:  31zook [ Fri Oct 22, 2010 5:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
i run vit calipers and a suby MC, waiting for the brakes to bed in but it's all a big improvement so far... and in a couple of weeks ill be R31 rear disks.... if the man wants to wait.... hope he does.... :?
Author:  bazook [ Fri Nov 26, 2010 9:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
thats a good price for the discs the cheapest i can get them for is $120 each and thats staff
Author:  steak_knife [ Fri Nov 26, 2010 10:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
bazook wrote:
thats a good price for the discs the cheapest i can get them for is $120 each and thats staff


:P I won't tell then... :lol:
Author:  bazook [ Sat Nov 27, 2010 9:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
pm me oh wise one
Author:  bristlenose2008 [ Sun Jan 23, 2011 3:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
paulv wrote:
As far as the end result being better - the brakes where shot before I started, so anything would have been better.#######################################
#####Just gotta get busy with the disk brake rear.....

##############


Hi Paule,

have you started on the rears? I would like to do the conversion, and at the moment I am considering 2 available online. One is from a NZ fella, who posts on this forum and he uses donor parts from a Mitsubishi Galant. Another option I have see sold in the US or Canada, was a small setup that uses donor parts from Suzuki Sierra.

Any other proven/tryed options?

Damien
Author:  paulv [ Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
I haven't started on the rears yet - too many other things on the todo list. Bloody Suzukis.

I have a kit from JoeBlow that allows the use of Nissan Skyline/Pintara calipers + standard front capliers in the shed.

Just gotta get around to doing it. There is till a bit of work though - will need to make up a new handbrake cable + redo the brake lines, etc.
So will have to wait until it can come off the road for a few days.

Suggest you PM JoeBlow. The rear disk kit is great!
Author:  bristlenose2008 [ Thu Feb 10, 2011 7:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
paulv wrote:
I haven't started on the rears yet - too many other things on the todo list. Bloody Suzukis.

I have a kit from JoeBlow that allows the use of Nissan Skyline/Pintara calipers + standard front capliers in the shed.

Just gotta get around to doing it. There is till a bit of work though - will need to make up a new handbrake cable + redo the brake lines, etc.
So will have to wait until it can come off the road for a few days.

Suggest you PM JoeBlow. The rear disk kit is great!


Surely you have started on this by now. Wednesday next week is my day off when I plan on doing one of two things on my little zook. Need the inspiration.....
Author:  bristlenose2008 [ Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
paulv wrote:
Hardest part was locating the donor calipers. Needed to be from specifically the 4 door variety Vit, built between 91-98


I have just been to a wrecker, and I was looking at the LWB Vitara which was a 1995 model, and it was a SV620VH. So it was a V6.

I got cold feet, so came back home to re-read this thread to see if the breaks meant to be off a SE416W (4cyllnder) or SV620VH (V6).

After further reading I realised that if there was any gain from this setup, than it was purely from the calipers, as the disc on the SWB is actually bigger than the LWB 4 cyinder. The more I research the more I think that the calipers off the V6 version would be the only worth while disc conversion, based on two things. Disc size on V6 much bigger, and being a more powerful and heavier car, the calipers would have been matched to it, therefor stronger than the 1.6L SWB & LWB.

DBA Rotor sizes:
DBA513 - 290 x 10 = Vitara SE416V SWB (mine)
DBA514 - 287 x 17 = Vitara SE416W LWB (smaller but more thicker than mine)
DBA518 - 310 x 22 = Vitara SV620VH LWB (larger & thicker than either of the above)

Had the original calipers and disc were in perfect order, my conclusion is that the rotor is not actually a "real improvement" over the original. So unless the calipers are very different from the original, I only see the SV620's as a considerable improvement, however I do not know if it would fit.
Author:  atari4x4 [ Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
you need 16's to clear the calipers on the SV brakes.
Author:  royce [ Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
bristlenose2008 wrote:
paulv wrote:
Hardest part was locating the donor calipers. Needed to be from specifically the 4 door variety Vit, built between 91-98


I have just been to a wrecker, and I was looking at the LWB Vitara which was a 1995 model, and it was a SV620VH. So it was a V6.

I got cold feet, so came back home to re-read this thread to see if the breaks meant to be off a SE416W (4cyllnder) or SV620VH (V6).

After further reading I realised that if there was any gain from this setup, than it was purely from the calipers, as the disc on the SWB is actually bigger than the LWB 4 cyinder. The more I research the more I think that the calipers off the V6 version would be the only worth while disc conversion, based on two things. Disc size on V6 much bigger, and being a more powerful and heavier car, the calipers would have been matched to it, therefor stronger than the 1.6L SWB & LWB.

DBA Rotor sizes:
DBA513 - 290 x 10 = Vitara SE416V SWB (mine)
DBA514 - 287 x 17 = Vitara SE416W LWB (smaller but more thicker than mine)
DBA518 - 310 x 22 = Vitara SV620VH LWB (larger & thicker than either of the above)

Had the original calipers and disc were in perfect order, my conclusion is that the rotor is not actually a "real improvement" over the original. So unless the calipers are very different from the original, I only see the SV620's as a considerable improvement, however I do not know if it would fit.


You have missed the point completely

The reason the wagon rotors are thicker is because they are vented, vented rotors in theory will cool down from heavy stopping a lot faster so there is less chance of fade.

The calipers are the same piston size more or less so dont exert any more force but the pads are a lot larger so more friction area

Trust me they are a huge improvement

While comparing size on the rotors to the v6 models, check the rotor offset, youll notice they are a lot different, so likely wont even fit a sierra (this is why 15" rims are a problem on any model fitted with those brakes)
Author:  Built4thrashing [ Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
Is it just me ot is there no detail on what suzuki this was done to. Im guessing its a coily sierra.
Author:  bristlenose2008 [ Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
damn.....I missed the point. This conversion was on a Sierra not a Vitara. The calipers on the sierra would have been a fair bit smaller, hence the vitara being an improvement.

wooooops
Author:  royce [ Mon Feb 14, 2011 10:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
nope, sierra and swb 1.6 vitara have almost identical sized brakes, the rotors will almost interchange and the vitara pads are a smidge smaller
Author:  CairnsZook [ Thu Feb 17, 2011 2:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
Built4thrashing wrote:
Is it just me ot is there no detail on what suzuki this was done to. Im guessing its a coily sierra.


Yep, coily.

And it's one of the few mods that can can be done to both a coily and a leafy.
In fact, it works better on the coily, because the bleed nipple ends up at the top of the caliper.


Here's some pics of Vit calipers on a leafy :)

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image
Author:  shandy92 [ Fri Mar 18, 2011 9:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
hey, small grave dig.

i will be fitting the lwb 1.6 brakes to my swb vit tomorrow and have a few questions, didnt think it was worthy of a new post.

i got the disk/caliper/pads off a guy on here, the pads have a fair bit of meat on them but im not sure about the disks. i just measured them and they have about 18mm, thats from end to end or face to face. these need to be machined as they have a bit of surface rust so depending on how much gets taken off they could be pretty thin (DBA514 - 287 x 17 = Vitara SE416W LWB (said by bristlenose2008) is these what i have?. so my questions is will these be ok to use or should i buy new disks?

is there anything i should do to the calipers while i have them here? ill be giving them a coat of paint to.

cheers
Mitch
Author:  alien [ Sun Mar 20, 2011 12:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
you can rebuild a caliper, but its something thats best left to an expert (brake arent something to mess with).

i had the 4dr brakes on mine before i went SPOA - they didnt bite any harder, but they just didnt fade... so you could go hard on them and never feel a mushy pedal which was nice - but i wouldnt say they had more stopping power than standard, because both those and standard can easily lock up all 4 wheels.

i had to remove my bigger front brakes due to SPOA conversion needing a hi-steer kit - which simply would not fit with such a large caliper hovering over the king pin.
Author:  shandy92 [ Sun Mar 20, 2011 12:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
thanks Aron- pity its all done now tho. ended up just stripping it down and giving it all a paint. greased the sliders and checked that the piston would move, which it did. i couldnt take it out as i dont have an air blower.

i asked some brake shop and they said it would be over $110 each caliper plus wouldnt be ready till monday. they also said, that because i asked to many questions they shouldnt be selling them to me as im "incompetent". isnt that why u ask questions so you know what ur doing?? ahah.

Mitch
Author:  alien [ Sun Mar 20, 2011 12:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
if they move freely and easily without any play then they dont need rebuilding... if theyre rusted and siezed then its an obvious safety hazard =) haha

as for being 'incompetent' - theyre covering their ass.. like i said, brakes arent to be toyed with. i personally won't touch the brakes on mine for that reason - i'd rather someone with experience do it so i know its done right and i'm not going to suffer some catastophic failure =)
Author:  shandy92 [ Sun Mar 20, 2011 12:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
alien wrote:
if they move freely and easily without any play then they dont need rebuilding... if theyre rusted and siezed then its an obvious safety hazard =) haha

as for being 'incompetent' - theyre covering their ass.. like i said, brakes arent to be toyed with. i personally won't touch the brakes on mine for that reason - i'd rather someone with experience do it so i know its done right and i'm not going to suffer some catastophic failure =)


yea i can understand that, thats also why i had someone help with the removal/install of the brakes. that way i know its checked over.
Author:  skyman [ Fri Apr 15, 2011 4:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
I was able to run 4 door Vitara brakes, with a half high steer on my Sierra (Samurai here). I had to grind the high steer arm a tiny bit, and sand a little off the caliper as well.

The upgraded front 4 door vit brakes made a very big difference for me in braking power, especially when loaded down with camping gear.

I think it will work with your Sierra's that have a high steer (depending on brand and style), that's also considering you guys have the steering wheel on the proper side of the vehicle. :mrgreen:

I did not do a rear disk conversion, or a new master cylinder (yet). However I
think that a bigger or better M/C combined with rear disks would improve the brake considerably.

I will try to get some pictures up tonight that show the mods I had to make to the high steer arm and caliper. All up it was $12 per caliper and disk ($24) at the wrecking yard, and maybe a 3 hour job to install including the High steer and caliper mods.
Author:  fordem [ Fri Apr 15, 2011 8:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Front brake upgrade - what I did.
Caliper rebuilds are not difficult and there are several illustrated "how tos" on the net - Honda calipers mostly, but the concepts are the same.

The nice thing about a caliper rebuild is that it is the piston that slides in and out & seals against the rubber ring, so minor pitting in the caliper bore (which is most commonly found on the flat "back" surface) is acceptable - as long as the area directly adjacent to the seal & dust cap grooves is clean & intact, that caliper is probably useable. Check the slide pins & the holes they run in - make sure there's no binding - if necessary polish them up with wire wool or similar - and once the slides and the bore check out as mentioned above, they'll be useable.

Turn your attention now to the pistons - make sure those are in mint condition - no rust, no pitting, no scoring on the outer - at the slightest hint, replace them - by the way - any decent machine shop, should be able to turn you a set of pistons from stainless steel stock - it won't have a chrome mirror finish, but it will work.

Get yourself rebuild kits, make sure you get sealing ring, dust boot, dust cap for the bleed nipple, and boots for the slide pins, get the rubber grease and the slide pin grease and have at it.

I did my first brake job as a kid 35 or so years ago, and the most recent (just about 24 months back) was a brake upgrade on a Swift - went from the OEM 230mm solid rotors to 250mm ventilated Brembo rotors, and the calipers I used were seized when I got them, and had to be completely disassembled & rebuilt - I wish I had done it sooner.
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